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- From: chris@questrel.com (Chris Cole)
- Subject: rec.puzzles Archive (decision), part 12 of 35
- Message-ID: <puzzles/archive/decision_745653851@questrel.com>
- Followup-To: rec.puzzles
- Summary: This is part of an archive of questions
- and answers that may be of interest to
- puzzle enthusiasts.
- Part 1 contains the index to the archive.
- Read the rec.puzzles FAQ for more information.
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- Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1993 06:05:17 GMT
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-
- Archive-name: puzzles/archive/decision
- Last-modified: 17 Aug 1993
- Version: 4
-
-
- ==> decision/allais.p <==
- The Allais Paradox involves the choice between two alternatives:
-
- A. 89% chance of an unknown amount
- 10% chance of $1 million
- 1% chance of $1 million
- B. 89% chance of an unknown amount (the same amount as in A)
- 10% chance of $2.5 million
- 1% chance of nothing
-
- What is the rational choice? Does this choice remain the same if the
- unknown amount is $1 million? If it is nothing?
-
- ==> decision/allais.s <==
- This is "Allais' Paradox".
-
- Which choice is rational depends upon the subjective value of money.
- Many people are risk averse, and prefer the better chance of $1
- million of option A. This choice is firm when the unknown amount is
- $1 million, but seems to waver as the amount falls to nothing. In the
- latter case, the risk averse person favors B because there is not much
- difference between 10% and 11%, but there is a big difference between
- $1 million and $2.5 million.
-
- Thus the choice between A and B depends upon the unknown amount, even
- though it is the same unknown amount independent of the choice. This
- violates the "independence axiom" that rational choice between two
- alternatives should depend only upon how those two alternatives
- differ.
-
- However, if the amounts involved in the problem are reduced to tens of
- dollars instead of millions of dollars, people's behavior tends to
- fall back in line with the axioms of rational choice. People tend to
- choose option B regardless of the unknown amount. Perhaps when
- presented with such huge numbers, people begin to calculate
- qualitatively. For example, if the unknown amount is $1 million the
- options are:
-
- A. a fortune, guaranteed
- B. a fortune, almost guaranteed
- a tiny chance of nothing
-
- Then the choice of A is rational. However, if the unknown amount is
- nothing, the options are:
-
- A. small chance of a fortune ($1 million)
- large chance of nothing
- B. small chance of a larger fortune ($2.5 million)
- large chance of nothing
-
- In this case, the choice of B is rational. The Allais Paradox then
- results from the limited ability to rationally calculate with such
- unusual quantities. The brain is not a calculator and rational
- calculations may rely on things like training, experience, and
- analogy, none of which would be help in this case. This hypothesis
- could be tested by studying the correlation between paradoxical
- behavior and "unusualness" of the amounts involved.
-
- If this explanation is correct, then the Paradox amounts to little
- more than the observation that the brain is an imperfect rational
- engine.
-
- ==> decision/division.p <==
- N-Person Fair Division
-
- If two people want to divide a pie but do not trust each other, they can
- still ensure that each gets a fair share by using the technique that one
- person cuts and the other person chooses. Generalize this technique
- to more than two people. Take care to ensure that no one can be cheated
- by a coalition of the others.
-
-
- ==> decision/division.s <==
- N-Person Fair Division
-
- Number the people from 1 to N. Person 1 cuts off a piece of the pie.
- Person 2 can either diminish the size of the cut off piece or pass.
- The same for persons 3 through N. The last person to touch the piece
- must take it and is removed from the process. Repeat this procedure
- with the remaining N - 1 people, until everyone has a piece.
-
- References:
- Luce and Raiffa, "Games and Decisions", Wiley, 1957, p. 366
- Kenneth Rebman, "How To Get (At Least) A Fair Share of the Cake",
- in Mathematical Plums, Ross Honsberger, ed, Dolciani Mathematical
- Expostions Number 4, published by the MAA.
-
- There is a cute result in combinatorics called the Marriage Theorem.
- A village has n men and n women, such that for all 0 < k <= n and for any
- set of k men there are at least k women, each of whom is in love with at least
- one of the k men. All of the men are in love with all of the women :-}.
- The theorem asserts that there is a way to arrange the village into n
- monogamous couplings.
-
- The Marriage Theorem can be applied to the Fair Pie-Cutting Problem.
-
- One player cuts the pie into n pieces. Each of the players labels
- some non-null subset of the pieces as acceptable to him. For reasons
- given below he should "accept" each piece of size > 1/n, not just the
- best piece(s). The pie-cutter is required to "accept" all of the pieces.
-
- Given a set S of players let S' denote the set of pie-pieces
- acceptable to at least one player in S. Let t be the size of the largest
- set (T) of players satisfying |T| > |T'|. If there is no such set, the
- Marriage Theorem can be applied directly. Since the pie-cutter accepts
- every piece we know that t < n.
-
- Choose |T| - |T'| pieces at random from outside T', glue them
- together with the pieces in T' and let the players in T repeat the game
- with this smaller (t/n)-size pie. This is fair since they all rejected
- the other n-t pieces, so they believe this pie is larger than t/n.
-
- The remaining n-t players can each be assigned one of the remaining
- n-t pie-pieces without further ado due to the Marriage Theorem. (Otherwise
- the set T above was not maximal.)
-
- The problem of getting not just a fair solution, but an envy-free solution,
- is not solved. A reference to this problem:
- David Gale, "Dividing a Cake," in Mathematical Entertainments,
- Mathematical Intelligencer, Vol. 15, No. 1, Winter 1993, p. 50,
- contains references to work by Steven Breams and Alan Taylor.
-
- ==> decision/dowry.p <==
- Sultan's Dowry
-
- A sultan has granted a commoner a chance to marry one of his hundred
- daughters. The commoner will be presented the daughters one at a time.
- When a daughter is presented, the commoner will be told the daughter's
- dowry. The commoner has only one chance to accept or reject each
- daughter; he cannot return to a previously rejected daughter.
- The sultan's catch is that the commoner may only marry the daughter with
- the highest dowry. What is the commoner's best strategy assuming
- he knows nothing about the distribution of dowries?
-
-
- ==> decision/dowry.s <==
- Solution
-
- Since the commoner knows nothing about the distribution of the dowries,
- the best strategy is to wait until a certain number of daughters have
- been presented then pick the highest dowry thereafter. The exact number to
- skip is determined by the condition that the odds that the highest dowry
- has already been seen is just greater than the odds that it remains to be
- seen AND THAT IF IT IS SEEN IT WILL BE PICKED. This amounts to finding the
- smallest x such that:
- x/n > x/n * (1/(x+1) + ... + 1/(n-1)).
- Working out the math for n=100 and calculating the probability gives:
- The commoner should wait until he has seen 37 of the daughters,
- then pick the first daughter with a dowry that is bigger than any
- preceding dowry. With this strategy, his odds of choosing the daughter
- with the highest dowry are surprisingly high: about 37%.
- (cf. F. Mosteller, "Fifty Challenging Problems in Probability with Solutions",
- Addison-Wesley, 1965, #47; "Mathematical Plums", edited by Ross Honsberger,
- pp. 104-110)
-
- Here's a twist on the sultan's dowry problem I hope hasn't been posted yet.
- I became interested in an iterated version of this problem, which goes as
- follows:
-
- There's a long line of suitors outside the sultan's palace, and one by one
- they come in. If a suitor gets the right girl, he marries her, as before.
- Unfortunately (for the suitor, at least), if he doesn't, he gets his head
- lopped off, and the next suitor comes in.
-
- Anyway, the first few dozen guys all know their probability theory, so they
- know that the best strategy is to skip the first 37 girls, and then pick
- the first girl who is the best up to that point. Alas, each one assumes
- that he's the only one who knows that strategy, so one by one, these few
- dozen guys get their heads lopped off.
-
- After the 49th head has just rolled down the hill, and the sultan's vizier
- has just cried out, "Next!" the next guy in line says, "This isn't working
- out. We might all be doing the same thing. It doesn't hurt any of us to
- tell the rest what strategy we'll be using, so that none of us sets out to
- pick the same girl over and over again. I might as well just tell you,
- though, that I'm going to get her! I know this great strategy where you
- skip the first 37 blah blah blah..." Naturally, a few moments later, head
- number 50 comes rolling down.
-
- "Next!" cries the vizier.
-
- Well, suitor number 51 is in a quandary. He's all set to skip 37, etc, etc,
- except now he knows, that's not the right strategy. But he doesn't know if
- the last guy skipped the right girl because she was in the first 37, or if
- he didn't meet her yet because he stopped too early.
-
- QUESTION 1: What is his best strategy?
-
- ANSWER 1: His best strategy is:
-
- "Skip the first 14. Take the first girl in [15,37] who is better
- than the first 14. If there isn't one, take the SECOND girl in [38,100]
- who is the best up to that point."
-
- Unfortunately, head number 51 rolls down the hill. "Next!" cries the vizier,
- who is getting a little hoarse, and wishes he didn't have this job.
-
- QUESTION 2: What is suitor number 52's best strategy?
-
- ANSWER 2: His best strategy is:
-
- "Skip the first 5. Take the first girl in [6,14] who is better than
- the first 5. If there isn't one, take the SECOND girl in [15,37]
- who is the best up to that point. If there isn't one, take the THIRD
- girl in [38,100] who is the best up to that point."
-
- By the end of the day, of course, a wedding will be set, won't it?
-
- MORE QUESTIONS: If each suitor uses the best strategy at that point, how
- many suitors will it take before the right girl is certain to be found?
- Does each succeeding suitor always have a better chance of winning
- than the preceding one?
-
- SPECULATION: The last strategy is "Pick the last girl." Its probability
- of success is 1. And it is strategy number 100. (The corresponding
- conditions hold for 3, 4, and 5 daughters.)
-
- Does anyone have any observations on this one?
-
- byron elbows
- (mail to brian@cs.ucla.edu)
-
-
-
- ==> decision/envelope.p <==
- Someone has prepared two envelopes containing money. One contains twice as
- much money as the other. You have decided to pick one envelope, but then the
- following argument occurs to you: Suppose my chosen envelope contains $X,
- then the other envelope either contains $X/2 or $2X. Both cases are
- equally likely, so my expectation if I take the other envelope is
- .5 * $X/2 + .5 * $2X = $1.25X, which is higher than my current $X, so I
- should change my mind and take the other envelope. But then I can apply the
- argument all over again. Something is wrong here! Where did I go wrong?
-
- In a variant of this problem, you are allowed to peek into the envelope
- you chose before finally settling on it. Suppose that when you peek you
- see $100. Should you switch now?
-
- ==> decision/envelope.s <==
- Let's follow the argument carefully, substituting real numbers for
- variables, to see where we went wrong. In the following, we will assume
- the envelopes contain $100 and $200. We will consider the two equally
- likely cases separately, then average the results.
-
- First, take the case that X=$100.
-
- "I have $100 in my hand. If I exchange I get $200. The value of the exchange
- is $200. The value from not exchanging is $100. Therefore, I gain $100
- by exchanging."
-
- Second, take the case that X=$200.
-
- "I have $200 in my hand. If I exchange I get $100. The value of the exchange
- is $100. The value from not exchanging is $200. Therefore, I lose $100
- by exchanging."
-
- Now, averaging the two cases, I see that the expected gain is zero.
-
- So where is the slip up? In one case, switching gets X/2 ($100), in the
- other case, switching gets 2X ($200), but X is different in the two
- cases, and I can't simply average the two different X's to get 1.25X.
- I can average the two numbers ($100 and $200) to get $150, the expected
- value of switching, which is also the expected value of not switching,
- but I cannot under any circumstances average X/2 and 2X.
-
- This is a classic case of confusing variables with constants.
-
- OK, so let's consider the case in which I looked into the envelope and
- found that it contained $100. This pins down what X is: a constant.
-
- Now the argument is that the odds of $50 is .5 and the odds of $200
- is .5, so the expected value of switching is $125, so we should switch.
- However, the only way the odds of $50 could be .5 and the odds of $200
- could be .5 is if all integer values are equally likely. But any
- probability distribution that is finite and equal for all integers
- would sum to infinity, not one as it must to be a probability distribution.
- Thus, the assumption of equal likelihood for all integer values is
- self-contradictory, and leads to the invalid proof that you should
- always switch. This is reminiscent of the plethora of proofs that 0=1;
- they always involve some illegitimate assumption, such as the validity
- of division by zero.
-
- Limiting the maximum value in the envelopes removes the self-contradiction
- and the argument for switching. Let's see how this works.
-
- Suppose all amounts up to $1 trillion were equally likely to be
- found in the first envelope, and all amounts beyond that would never
- appear. Then for small amounts one should indeed switch, but not for
- amounts above $500 billion. The strategy of always switching would pay
- off for most reasonable amounts but would lead to disastrous losses for
- large amounts, and the two would balance each other out.
-
- For those who would prefer to see this worked out in detail:
- Assume the smaller envelope is uniform on [$0,$M], for some value
- of $M. What is the expectation value of always switching? A quarter of
- the time $100 >= $M (i.e. 50% chance $X is in [$M/2,$M] and 50% chance
- the larger envelope is chosen). In this case the expected switching
- gain is -$50 (a loss). Thus overall the always switch policy has an
- expected (relative to $100) gain of (3/4)*$50 + (1/4)*(-$50) = $25.
- However the expected absolute gain (in terms of M) is:
- / M
- | g f(g) dg, [ where f(g) = (1/2)*Uniform[0,M)(g) +
- /-M (1/2)*Uniform(-M,0](g). ]
-
- = 0. QED.
-
- OK, so always switching is not the optimal switching strategy. Surely
- there must be some strategy that takes advantage of the fact that we
- looked into the envelope and we know something we did not know before
- we looked.
-
- Well, if we know the maximum value $M that can be in the smaller envelope,
- then the optimal decision criterion is to switch if $100 < $M, otherwise stick.
- The reason for the stick case is straightforward. The reason for the
- switch case is due to the pdf of the smaller envelope being twice as
- high as that of the larger envelope over the range [0,$M). That is, the
- expected gain in switching is (2/3)*$100 + (1/3)*(-$50) = $50.
-
- What if we do not know the maximum value of the pdf? You can exploit
- the "test value" technique to improve your chances. The trick here is
- to pick a test value T. If the amount in the envelope is less than the
- test value, switch; if it is more, do not. This works in that if T happens
- to be in the range [M,2M] you will make the correct decision. Therefore,
- assuming the unknown pdf is uniform on [0,M], you are slightly better off
- with this technique.
-
- Of course, the pdf may not even be uniform, so the "test value" technique
- may not offer much of an advantage. If you are allowed to play the game
- repeatedly, you can estimate the pdf, but that is another story...
-
- ==> decision/exchange.p <==
- At one time, the Canadian and US dollars were discounted by 10 cents on
- each side of the border (i.e., a Canadian dollar was worth 90 US cents
- in the US, and a US dollar was worth 90 Canadian cents in Canada). A
- man walks into a bar on the US side of the border, orders 10 US cents
- worth of beer, pays with a US dollar and receives a Canadian dollar in
- change. He then walks across the border to Canada, orders 10 Canadian
- cents worth of beer, pays with a Canadian dollar and receives a US
- dollar in change. He continues this throughout the day, and ends up
- dead drunk with the original dollar in his pocket.
-
- Who pays for the drinks?
-
- ==> decision/exchange.s <==
- The man paid for all the drinks. But, you say, he ended up with the
- same amount of money that he started with! However, as he transported
- Canadian dollars into Canada and US dollars into the US, he performed
- "economic work" by moving the currency to a location where it was in
- greater demand (and thus valued higher). The earnings from this work
- were spent on the drinks.
-
- Note that he can only continue to do this until the Canadian bar runs
- out of US dollars, or the US bar runs out of Canadian dollars, i.e.,
- until he runs out of "work" to do.
-
- ==> decision/high.or.low.p <==
- I pick two numbers, randomly, and tell you one of them. You are supposed
- to guess whether this is the lower or higher one of the two numbers I
- picked. Can you come up with a method of guessing that does better than
- picking the response "low" or "high" randomly (i.e. probability to guess
- right > .5) ?
-
- ==> decision/high.or.low.s <==
- Pick any cumulative probability function P(x) such that a > b ==> P(a)
- > P(b). Now if the number shown is y, guess "low" with probability
- P(y) and "high" with probability 1-P(y). This strategy yields a
- probability of > 1/2 of winning since the probability of being correct
- is 1/2*( (1-P(a)) + P(b) ) = 1/2 + (P(b)-P(a)), which is > 1/2 by
- assumption.
-
- ==> decision/monty.hall.p <==
- You are a participant on "Let's Make a Deal." Monty Hall shows you
- three closed doors. He tells you that two of the closed doors have a
- goat behind them and that one of the doors has a new car behind it.
- You pick one door, but before you open it, Monty opens one of the two
- remaining doors and shows that it hides a goat. He then offers you a
- chance to switch doors with the remaining closed door. Is it to your
- advantage to do so?
-
- ==> decision/monty.hall.s <==
- Under reasonable assumptions about Monty Hall's motivation, your chance
- of picking the car doubles when you switch.
-
- The problem is confusing for two reasons: first, there are hidden
- assumptions about Monty's motivation that cloud the issue; and second,
- novice probability students do not see that the opening of the door
- gave them any new information.
-
- Monty can have one of three basic motives:
- 1. He randomly opens doors.
- 2. He always opens the door he knows contains nothing.
- 3. He only opens a door when the contestant has picked the grand prize.
-
- These result in very different strategies:
- 1. No improvement when switching.
- 2. Double your odds by switching.
- 3. Don't switch!
-
- Most people, myself included, think that (2) is the intended
- interpretation of Monty's motive. Interviews with Monty Hall
- indicate that he did indeed try to lure the contestant who had picked
- the car with cash incentives to switch. However, if Monty always
- adopted this strategy, contestants would soon learn never to switch,
- so one presumes that occasionally Monty offered another door even when
- the contestant had picked a goat. At any rate, analyzing the problem
- with this strategy is difficult, since it requires knowing something
- about Monty's probability of bluffing.
-
- A good way to see that Monty is giving you information by opening doors
- that he knows are valueless is to increase the number of doors from
- three to 100. If there are 100 doors, and Monty shows that 98 of them
- are valueless, isn't it pretty clear that the chance the prize is behind
- the remaining door is 99/100?
-
- The original Monty Hall problem (and solution) appears to be due to
- Steve Selvin, and appears in American Statistician, Feb 1975, V. 29,
- No. 1, p. 67 under the title ``A Problem in Probability.'' It should
- be of no surprise to readers of this group that he received several
- letters contesting the accuracy of his solution, so he responded two
- issues later (American Statistician, Aug 1975, V. 29, No. 3, p. 134).
- However, the principles that underlie the problem date back at least to
- the fifties, and probably are timeless. See the references below for
- details.
-
- Reference (too numerous to mention, but these contain bibliographies):
- Leonard Gillman, "The Car and the Goats", AMM 99:1 (Jan 1992), p. 3
- Ed Barbeau, "The Problem of the Car and Goats", CMJ 24:2 (Mar 1993), p. 149
-
- The second reference contains a list of equivalent or related problems.
-
- ==> decision/newcomb.p <==
- Newcomb's Problem
-
- A being put one thousand dollars in box A and either zero or one million
- dollars in box B and presents you with two choices:
- (1) Open box B only.
- (2) Open both box A and B.
- The being put money in box B only if it predicted you will choose option (1).
- The being put nothing in box B if it predicted you will do anything other than
- choose option (1) (including choosing option (2), flipping a coin, etc.).
-
- Assuming that you have never known the being to be wrong in predicting your
- actions, which option should you choose to maximize the amount of money you
- get?
-
-
- ==> decision/newcomb.s <==
- This is "Newcomb's Paradox".
-
- You are presented with two boxes: one certainly contains $1000 and the
- other might contain $1 million. You can either take one box or both.
- You cannot change what is in the boxes. Therefore, to maximize your
- gain you should take both boxes.
-
- However, it might be argued that you can change the probability that
- the $1 million is there. Since there is no way to change whether the
- million is in the box or not, what does it mean that you can change
- the probability that the million is in the box? It means that your
- choice is correlated with the state of the box.
-
- Events which proceed from a common cause are correlated. My mental
- states lead to my choice and, very probably, to the state of the box.
- Therefore my choice and the state of the box are highly correlated.
- In this sense, my choice changes the "probability" that the money is
- in the box. However, since your choice cannot change the state of the
- box, this correlation is irrelevant.
-
- The following argument might be made: your expected gain if you take
- both boxes is (nearly) $1000, whereas your expected gain if you take
- one box is (nearly) $1 million, therefore you should take one box.
- However, this argument is fallacious. In order to compute the
- expected gain, one would use the formulas:
-
- E(take one) = $0 * P(predict take both | take one) +
- $1,000,000 * P(predict take one | take one)
- E(take both) = $1,000 * P(predict take both | take both) +
- $1,001,000 * P(predict take one | take both)
-
- While you are given that P(do X | predict X) is high, it is not given
- that P(predict X | do X) is high. Indeed, specifying that P(predict X
- | do X) is high would be equivalent to specifying that the being could
- use magic (or reverse causality) to fill the boxes. Therefore, the
- expected gain from either action cannot be determined from the
- information given.
-
-
- ==> decision/prisoners.p <==
- Three prisoners on death row are told that one of them has been chosen
- at random for execution the next day, but the other two are to be
- freed. One privately begs the warden to at least tell him the name of
- one other prisoner who will be freed. The warden relents: 'Susie will
- go free.' Horrified, the first prisoner says that because he is now
- one of only two remaining prisoners at risk, his chances of execution
- have risen from one-third to one-half! Should the warden have kept his
- mouth shut?
-
- ==> decision/prisoners.s <==
- Each prisoner had an equal chance of being the one chosen to be
- executed. So we have three cases:
-
- Prisoner executed: A B C
- Probability of this case: 1/3 1/3 1/3
-
- Now, if A is to be executed, the warden will randomly choose either B or C,
- and tell A that name. When B or C is the one to be executed, there is only
- one prisoner other than A who will not be executed, and the warden will always
- give that name. So now we have:
-
- Prisoner executed: A A B C
- Name given to A: B C C B
- Probability: 1/6 1/6 1/3 1/3
-
- We can calculate all this without knowing the warden's answer.
- When he tells us B will not be executed, we eliminate the middle two
- choices above. Now, among the two remaining cases, C is twice
- as likely as A to be the one executed. Thus, the probability that
- A will be executed is still 1/3, and C's chances are 2/3.
-
- ==> decision/red.p <==
- I show you a shuffled deck of standard playing cards, one card at a
- time. At any point before I run out of cards, you must say "RED!".
- If the next card I show is red (i.e. diamonds or hearts), you win. We
- assume I the "dealer" don't have any control over what the order of
- cards is.
-
- The question is, what's the best strategy, and what is your
- probability of winning ?
-
- ==> decision/red.s <==
- If a deck has n cards, r red and b black, the best strategy wins
- with a probability of r/n. Thus, you can say "red" on the first card,
- the last card, or any other card you wish.
- Proof by induction on n. The statement is clearly true for one-card decks.
- Suppose it is true for n-card decks, and add a red card.
- I will even allow a nondeterministic strategy, meaning you say "red"
- on the first card with probability p. With probability 1-p,
- you watch the first card go by, and then apply the "optimal" strategy
- to the remaining n-card deck, since you now know its composition.
- The odds of winning are therefore: p * (r+1)/(n+1) +
- (1-p) * ((r+1)/(n+1) * r/n + b/(n+1) * (r+1)/n).
- After some algebra, this becomes (r+1)/(n+1) as expected.
- Adding a black card yields: p * r/(n+1) +
- (1-p) * (r/(n+1) * (r-1)/n + (b+1)/(n+1) * r/n).
- This becomes r/(n+1) as expected.
-
- ==> decision/rotating.table.p <==
- Four glasses are placed upside down in the four corners of a square
- rotating table. You wish to turn them all in the same direction,
- either all up or all down. You may do so by grasping any two glasses
- and, optionally, turning either over. There are two catches: you are
- blindfolded and the table is spun after each time you touch the
- glasses. Assuming that a bell rings when you have all the glasses up,
- how do you do it?
-
- ==> decision/rotating.table.s <==
- 1. Turn two adjacent glasses up.
- 2. Turn two diagonal glasses up.
- 3. Pull out two diagonal glasses. If one is down, turn it up and you're done.
- If not, turn one down and replace.
- 4. Take two adjacent glasses. Invert them both.
- 5. Take two diagonal glasses. Invert them both.
-
- References
- "Probing the Rotating Table"
- W. T. Laaser and L. Ramshaw
- _The Mathematical Gardner_,
- Wadsworth International, Belmont CA 1981.
-
- ... we will see that such a procedure exists if and
- only if the parameters k and n satisfy the inequality
- k >= (1-1/p)n, where p is the largest prime factor
- of n.
-
- The paper mentions (without discussing) two other generalizations:
- more than two orientations of the glasses (Graham and Diaconis)
- and more symmetries in the table, e.g. those of a cube (Kim).
-
- ==> decision/stpetersburg.p <==
- What should you be willing to pay to play a game in which the payoff is
- calculated as follows: a coin is flipped until it comes up heads on the
- nth toss and the payoff is set at 2^n dollars?
-
- ==> decision/stpetersburg.s <==
- Classical decision theory says that you should be willing to pay any
- amount up to the expected value of the wager. Let's calculate the
- expected value: The probability of winning at step n is 2^-n, and the
- payoff at step n is 2^n, so the sum of the products of the
- probabilities and the payoffs is:
-
- E = sum over n (2^-n * 2^n) = sum over n (1) = infinity
-
- So you should be willing to pay any amount to play this game. This is
- called the "St. Petersburg Paradox."
-
- The classical solution to this problem was given by Bernoulli. He
- noted that people's desire for money is not linear in the amount of
- money involved. In other words, people do not desire $2 million twice
- as much as they desire $1 million. Suppose, for example, that people's
- desire for money is a logarithmic function of the amount of money.
- Then the expected VALUE of the game is:
-
- E = sum over n (2^-n * C * log(2^n)) = sum over n (2^-n * C' * n) = C''
-
- Here the C's are constants that depend upon the risk aversion of the
- player, but at least the expected value is finite. However, it turns
- out that these constants are usually much higher than people are really
- willing to pay to play, and in fact it can be shown that any
- non-bounded utility function (map from amount of money to value of
- money) is prey to a generalization of the St. Petersburg paradox. So
- the classical solution of Bernoulli is only part of the story.
-
- The rest of the story lies in the observation that bankrolls are always
- finite, and this dramatically reduces the amount you are willing to bet
- in the St. Petersburg game.
-
- To figure out what would be a fair value to charge for playing the game
- we must know the bank's resources. Assume that the bank has 1 million
- dollars (1*K*K = 2^20). I cannot possibly win more than $1 million
- whether I toss 20 tails in a row or 2000.
-
- Therefore my expected amount of winning is
-
- E = sum n up to 20 (2^-n * 2^n) = sum n up to 20 (1) = $20
-
- and my expected value of winning is
-
- E = sum n up to 20 (2^-n * C * log(2^n)) = some small number
-
- This is much more in keeping with what people would really pay to
- play the game.
-
- Incidentally, T.C. Fry suggested this change to the problem in 1928
- (see W.W.R. Ball, Mathematical Recreations and Essays, N.Y.: Macmillan,
- 1960, pp. 44-45).
-
- The problem remains interesting when modified in this way,
- for the following reason. For a particular value of the bank's
- resources, let
-
- e denote the expected value of the player's winnings; and let
- p denote the probability that the player profits from the game, assuming
- the price of getting into the game is 0.8e (20% discount).
-
- Note that the expected value of the player's profit is 0.2e. Now
- let's vary the bank's resources and observe how e and p change. It
- will be seen that as e (and hence the expected value of the profit)
- increases, p diminishes. The more the game is to the player's
- advantage in terms of expected value of profit, the less likely it is
- that the player will come away with any profit at all. This
- is mildly counterintuitive.
-
- ==> decision/truel.p <==
- A, B, and C are to fight a three-cornered pistol duel. All know that
- A's chance of hitting his target is 0.3, C's is 0.5, and B never misses.
- They are to fire at their choice of target in succession in the order
- A, B, C, cyclically (but a hit man loses further turns and is no longer
- shot at) until only one man is left. What should A's strategy be?
-
- ==> decision/truel.s <==
- This is problem 20 in Mosteller _Fifty Challenging Problems in Probability_
- and it also appears (with an almost identical solution) on page 82 in
- Larsen & Marx _An Introduction to Probability and Its Applications_.
-
- Here's Mosteller's solution:
-
- A is naturally not feeling cheery about this enterprise. Having the
- first shot he sees that, if he hits C, B will then surely hit him, and
- so he is not going to shoot at C. If he shoots at B and misses him,
- then B clearly {I disagree; this is not at all clear!} shoots the more
- dangerous C first, and A gets one shot at B with probability 0.3 of
- succeeding. If he misses this time, the less said the better. On the
- other hand, suppose A hits B. Then C and A shoot alternately until one
- hits. A's chance of winning is (.5)(.3) + (.5)^2(.7)(.3) +
- (.5)^3(.7)^2(.3) + ... . Each term corresponds to a sequence of misses
- by both C and A ending with a final hit by A. Summing the geometric
- series we get ... 3/13 < 3/10. Thus hitting B and finishing off with
- C has less probability of winning for A than just missing the first shot.
- So A fires his first shot into the ground and then tries to hit B with
- his next shot. C is out of luck.
-
- As much as I respect Mosteller, I have some serious problems with this
- solution. If we allow the option of firing into the ground, then if
- all fire into the ground with every shot, each will survive with
- probability 1. Now, the argument could be made that a certain
- strategy for X that both allows them to survive with probability 1
- *and* gives less than a probability of survival of less than 1 for
- at least one of their foes would be preferred by X. However, if
- X pulls the trigger and actually hits someone what would the remaining
- person, say Y, do? If P(X hits)=1, clearly Y must try to hit X, since
- X firing at Y with intent to hit dominates any other strategy for X.
- If P(X hits)<1 and X fires at Y with intent to hit, then
- P(Y survives)<1 (since X could have hit Y). Thus, Y must insure that
- X can not follow this strategy by shooting back at X (thus insuring
- that P(X survives)<1). Therefore, I would conclude that the ideal
- strategy for all three players, assuming that they are rational and
- value survival above killing their enemies, would be to keep firing
- into the ground. If they don't value survival above killing their
- enemies (which is the only a priori assumption that I feel can be
- safely made in the absence of more information), then the problem
- can't be solved unless the function each player is trying to maximize
- is explicitly given.
- --
- -- clong@remus.rutgers.edu (Chris Long)
-
- OK - I'll have a go at this.
-
- How about the payoff function being 1 if you win the "duel" (i.e. if at some
- point you are still standing and both the others have been shot) and 0
- otherwise? This should ensure that an infinite sequence of deliberate misses
- is not to anyone's advantage. Furthermore, I don't think simple survival
- makes a realistic payoff function, since people with such a payoff function
- would not get involved in the fight in the first place!
-
- [ I.e. I am presupposing a form of irrationality on the part of the
- fighters: they're only interested in survival if they win the duel. Come
- to think of it, this may be quite rational - spending the rest of my life
- firing a gun into the ground would be a very unattractive proposition to
- me :-)
- ]
-
- Now, denote each position in the game by the list of people left standing,
- in the order in which they get their turns (so the initial position is
- (A,B,C), and the position after A misses the first shot (B,C,A)). We need to
- know the value of each possible position for each person.
-
- By definition:
-
- valA(A) = 1 valB(A) = 0 valC(A) = 0
- valA(B) = 0 valB(B) = 1 valC(B) = 0
- valA(C) = 0 valB(C) = 0 valC(C) = 1
-
- Consider the two player position (X,Y). An infinite sequence of misses has
- value zero to both players, and each player can ensure a positive payoff by
- trying to shoot the other player. So both players deliberately missing is a
- sub-optimal result for both players. The question is then whether both
- players should try to shoot the other first, or whether one should let the
- other take the first shot. Since having the first shot is always an
- advantage, given that some real shots are going to be fired, both players
- should try to shoot the other first. It is then easy to establish that:
-
- valA(A,B) = 3/10 valB(A,B) = 7/10 valC(A,B) = 0
- valA(B,A) = 0 valB(B,A) = 1 valC(B,A) = 0
- valA(B,C) = 0 valB(B,C) = 1 valC(B,C) = 0
- valA(C,B) = 0 valB(C,B) = 5/10 valC(C,B) = 5/10
- valA(C,A) = 3/13 valB(C,A) = 0 valC(C,A) = 10/13
- valA(A,C) = 6/13 valB(A,C) = 0 valC(A,C) = 7/13
-
- Now for the three player positions (A,B,C), (B,C,A) and (C,A,B). Again, the
- fact that an infinite sequence of misses is sub-optimal for all three
- players means that at least one player is going to decide to fire. However,
- it is less clear than in the 2 player case that any particular player is
- going to fire. In the 2 player case, each player knew that *if* it was
- sub-optimal for him to fire, then it was optimal for the other player to
- fire *at him* and that he would be at a disadvantage in the ensuing duel
- because of not having got the first shot. This is not necessarily true in
- the 3 player case.
-
- Consider the payoff to A in the position (A,B,C). If he shoots at B, his
- expected payoff is:
-
- 0.3*valA(C,A) + 0.7*valA(B,C,A) = 9/130 + 0.7*valA(B,C,A)
-
- If he shoots at C, his expected payoff is:
-
- 0.3*valA(B,A) + 0.7*valA(B,C,A) = 0.7*valA(B,C,A)
-
- And if he deliberately misses, his expected payoff is:
-
- valA(B,C,A)
-
- Since he tries to maximise his payoff, we can immediately eliminate shooting
- at C as a strategy - it is strictly dominated by shooting at B. So A's
- expected payoff is:
-
- valA(A,B,C) = MAX(valA(B,C,A), 9/130 + 0.7*valA(B,C,A))
-
- A similar argument shows that C's expected payoffs in the (C,A,B) position are:
-
- For shooting at A: 0.5*valC(A,B,C)
- For shooting at B: 35/130 + 0.5*valC(A,B,C)
- For missing: valC(A,B,C)
-
- So C either shoots at B or deliberately misses, and:
-
- valC(C,A,B) = MAX(valC(A,B,C), 35/130 + 0.5*valC(A,B,C))
-
- Each player can obtain a positive expected payoff by shooting at one of the
- other players, and it is known that an infinite sequence of misses will
- result in a zero payoff for all players. So it is known that some player's
- strategy must involve shooting at another player rather than deliberately
- missing.
-
- Now look at this from the point of view of player B. He knows that *if* it
- is sub-optimal for him to shoot at another player, then it is optimal for at
- least one of the other players to shoot. He also knows that if the other
- players choose to shoot, they will shoot *at him*. If he deliberately
- misses, therefore, the best that he can hope for is that they miss him and
- he is presented with the same situation again. This is clearly less good for
- him than getting his shot in first. So in position (B,C,A), he must shoot at
- another player rather than deliberately miss.
-
- B's expected payoffs are:
-
- For shooting at A: valB(C,B) = 5/10
- For shooting at C: valB(A,B) = 7/10
-
- So in position (B,C,A), B shoots at C for an expected payoff of 7/10. This
- gives us:
-
- valA(B,C,A) = 3/10 valB(B,C,A) = 7/10 valC(B,C,A) = 0
-
- So valA(A,B,C) = MAX(3/10, 9/130 + 21/100) = 3/10, and A's best strategy is
- position (A,B,C) is to deliberately miss, giving us:
-
- valA(A,B,C) = 3/10 valB(A,B,C) = 7/10 valC(A,B,C) = 0
-
- And finally, valC(C,A,B) = MAX(0, 35/130 + 0) = 7/26, and C's best strategy
- in position (C,A,B) is to shoot at B, giving us:
-
- valA(C,A,B) = 57/260 valB(C,A,B) = 133/260 valC(C,A,B) = 7/26
-
- I suspect that, with this payoff function, all positions with 3 players can
- be resolved. For each player, we can establish that if their correct
- strategy is to fire at another player, then it is to fire at whichever of
- the other players is more dangerous. The most dangerous of the three players
- then finds that he has nothing to lose by firing at the second most
- dangerous.
-
- Questions:
-
- (a) In the general case, what are the optimal strategies for the other two
- players, possibly as functions of the hit probabilities and the cyclic
- order of the three players?
-
- (b) What happens in the 4 or more player case?
-
- -- David Seal <dseal@armltd.co.uk>
-
- In article <1993Mar25.022459.10269@cs.cornell.edu>, karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr) writes:
- > The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly are standing at three equidistant
- "P" "Q" "R" -- allow me these alternate names.
- > points around a very large circle, about to fight a three-way duel to
- > see who gets the treasure. They all know that the Good hits with
- > probability p=.9, the Bad hits with probability q=.7, and the Ugly
- > hits with probability r=.5.
- >
- > Yes, I know this sounds like decision/truel from the rec.puzzles
- > archive. But here's the difference:
- >
- > At some instant, all three will fire simultaneously, each at a target
- > of his choice. Then any who survive that round fire simultaneously
- > again, until at most one remains. Note that there are then four
- > possible outcomes: the Good wins, the Bad wins, the Ugly wins, or all
- > are killed.
-
- A multi-round multi-person game can get complicated if implicit
- alliances are formed or the players deduce each other's strategies.
- For simplicity let's disallow communication and assume the players
- forget who shot at whom after each round.
- >
- > Now the questions:
-
- These are not easy questions, even with the simplifying
- assumptions I've made.
-
- >
- > 1. What is each shooter's strategy?
-
- Each player has two possible strategies so there are eight cases
- to consider; unfortunately none of the players has a strictly
- dominant strategy:
-
- P aims at Q aims at R aims at P survival Q survival R survival Noone lives
- --------- --------- --------- ---------- ---------- ---------- -----------
- Q P P 0.0649 0.0355 0.7991 0.1005
- Q P Q 0.1371 0.0146 0.6966 0.1517
- * Q R P 0.3946 0.0444 0.1470 0.4140
- Q R Q 0.8221 0.0026 0.0152 0.1601
- R P P 0.0381 0.8221 0.0152 0.1246
- * R P Q 0.1824 0.3443 0.0426 0.4307
- R R P 0.1371 0.5342 0.0027 0.3260
- R R Q 0.6367 0.0355 0.0008 0.3270
-
- (The similarity of, say, the 4th and 5th lines here looks wrong:
- the intermediate expressions are quite different. I can't
- explain *why* P_survival(q,r,q) = Q_survival(r,p,p) = 0.8221
- but I *have* double-checked this result.)
-
- If I *know* who my opponents are going to aim at, I should shoot
- at the better shooter if they're both aiming at me or neither is
- aiming at me. Otherwise I should aim at whoever is *not* aiming
- at me. There are two equilibrium points (marked "*" above):
- Good aims at Bad; Bad aims at Ugly; Ugly aims at Good.
- and
- Good aims at Ugly; Bad aims at Good; Ugly aims at Bad.
- Here, unlike for zero-sum two-person games, the equilibria
- are *not* equivalent and "solution", if any, may lie elsewhere.
- Perhaps a game-theorist lurking in r.p can offer a better comment.
-
- Note that the probability all three shooters die is highest at
- the equilibria! This seems rather paradoxical and rather sad :-(
- >
- > 2. Who is most likely to survive?
-
- Good, Bad, or Ugly, depending on the strategies.
- >
- > 3. Who is least likely to survive?
- >
- Bad or Ugly, depending on the strategies.
-
- > 4. Can you change p, q, and r under the constraint p > q > r so that
- > the answers to questions 2 and 3 are reversed? Which of the six
- > possible permutations of the three shooters is a possible ordering
- > of probability of survival under the constraint p > q > r?
-
- Yes. Of the six possible survival-probability orderings,
- five can be obtained readily:
- p q r P_surv Q_surv R_surv Order
- --- --- --- ------ ------ ------ -------
- 0.255 0.25 0.01 0.408 0.413 0.172 Q P R
- 0.26 0.25 0.01 0.412 0.406 0.173 P Q R
- 0.75 0.25 0.01 0.675 0.076 0.242 P R Q
- 0.505 0.50 0.01 0.325 0.324 0.344 R P Q
- 0.505 0.50 0.02 0.314 0.320 0.353 R Q P
-
- Unlike the p=.9, q=.7, r=.5 case we are given, the five cases
- in this table *do* have simple pure solutions: in each case
- p shoots at q, while q and r each shoot at p. (I've found no
- case with a "simple pure" solution other than this "obvious"
- p aims at q, q aims at p, r aims at p choice.)
-
- >
- > 5. Are there any value of p, q, and r for which it is ever in the
- > interest of one of the shooters to fire into the ground?
-
- No. It can't hurt to shoot at one's stronger opponent.
- This is the easiest of the questions ... but it's still
- not easy enough for me to construct an elegant proof
- in English.
-
- >
- > -- David Karr (karr@cs.cornell.edu)
- >
- Speaking of decision/truel, I recall a *very* interesting
- analysis (I *might* have seen it here in rec.puzzles) suggesting
- that the N-person "truel" (N-uel?) has a Cooperative Solution
- (ceasefire) if and only if N = 3. But I don't see this in the
- FAQL; anyone care to repost it?
-
- -- James Allen
-
- In article <1993Apr1.123404.18039@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> mkt@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
- >In article <1993Mar25.022459.10269@cs.cornell.edu>, karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr) writes:
- [...]
- >> 5. Are there any value of p, q, and r for which it is ever in the
- >> interest of one of the shooters to fire into the ground?
- >>
- > Yes, p=1, q=1, r=1. The only way for one to survive is to have the other
- > two shoot at eachother. Shooting at anyone has no effect on ones personal
- > survival.
-
- I assume by "has no effect on" you mean "does not improve."
-
- > If all follow the same logic, they will keep shooting into the
- > ground and thus all live.
-
- I was very pleased by this answer but I had to think about it. First
- of all, it assumes that continuing the fight forever has a positive
- value for each shooter. My preferred assumption is that it doesn't.
- But even if each shooter is simply trying to maximize his probability
- of never being shot, I wonder about the "has no effect" statement.
-
- Suppose that in round 1 the Good fires into the ground and the Bad
- shoots at the Good. Then the Ugly lives if he shoots the Bad and dies
- if he does anything else. (The Bad will surely shoot at the Ugly if
- he can in round 2, since this dominates any other strategy.) So it
- definitely makes a difference to the Ugly in this case to shoot at the
- Bad.
-
- But all this is under the assumption that no shooter can tell what
- the others are about to do until after all have shot. This isn't
- entirely unreasonable--we can certainly set up a game that plays
- this way--but suppose we assume instead:
-
- All three start out with guns initially holstered.
- Each one is a blindingly fast shot: he can grab his holstered gun,
- aim, and fire in 0.6 second.
- A shooter can redirect his unholstered gun at a different target and
- fire in just 0.4 second.
- The reaction time of each shooter is just 0.2 second. That is, any
- decision he makes to act can be based only on the actions of the
- other two up to 0.2 second before he initiates his own action.
- The bullets travel between shooters in less than 0.1 second and
- stop any further action when they hit.
-
- Then I *think* the conclusion holds for p=q=r=1: The best strategy is
- to wait for someone else to grab for their gun, then shoot that
- person, therefore nobody will shoot at anyone. At least I haven't yet
- thought of a case in which you improve your survival by shooting at
- anyone. Of course this is only good if you don't mind waiting around
- the circle forever.
-
- -- David Karr (karr@cs.cornell.edu)
-
- In article <1993Apr5.210749.2657@cs.cornell.edu>,
- karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr) writes:
- > In article <1993Apr1.123404.18039@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> mkt@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
- >>In article <1993Mar25.022459.10269@cs.cornell.edu>, karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr) writes:
- > [...]
- >>> 5. Are there any value of p, q, and r for which it is ever in the
- >>> interest of one of the shooters to fire into the ground?
- >>>
- >> Yes, p=1, q=1, r=1. The only way for one to survive is to have the other
- >> two shoot at eachother. Shooting at anyone has no effect on ones personal
- >> survival.
-
- >
- > I assume by "has no effect on" you mean "does not improve."
- >
- >> If all follow the same logic, they will keep shooting into the
- >> ground and thus all live.
- >
- > I was very pleased by this answer but I had to think about it. First
- > of all, it assumes that continuing the fight forever has a positive
- > value for each shooter. My preferred assumption is that it doesn't.
- > But even if each shooter is simply trying to maximize his probability
- > of never being shot, I wonder about the "has no effect" statement.
- >
- > Suppose that in round 1 the Good fires into the ground and the Bad
- > shoots at the Good. Then the Ugly lives if he shoots the Bad and dies
- > if he does anything else. (The Bad will surely shoot at the Ugly if
- > he can in round 2, since this dominates any other strategy.) So it
- > definitely makes a difference to the Ugly in this case to shoot at the
- > Bad.
- >
-
- Here's where the clincher comes in! If we "assume" the object of the game
- is to survive, and that there exists _one_ unique method for survival, then
- all the shooters will behave in the same fashion. Obviously the above case
- will not hold. How do we distinguish between the good, the bad and the ugly?
- If the command is "Shoot" then all will shoot and somebody is going to wind up
- lucky (Prob that it is you is 1/3). If the command is "No Shoot", then all
- will fire into the ground (or just give up and go home--no sense waitin' around
- wastin' time, ya know)...
-
- But wait, you cry! What if there exists _more than one_ solution for optimal
- survival. Then what? Will the Good the Bad and the Ugly each randomly decide
- between "Shoot" and "No Shoot" with .5 probability? If this is true, then is
- it in your best interest to shoot someone? If it is, then we arrive back at
- square one: since we assume all shooters are geniouses, then all will shoot--
- arriving at an optimal solution of "Shooting". If the answer is "No Shooting",
- we arrive at an optimal solution of "No Shooting". If there is no effect on
- your personal survival, then do we analyze this with another .5 probability
- between the chances of soemone shooting or not shooting? If the answer to this
- is "Shoot" then we arrive at square one: all will Shoot; if no, then all will
- withold. If there is no effect, then we arrive at another .5 probability...
- Obviously you can see the recursion of this process.
-
- Perhaps this would be easier to discuss if we let p=1, q=1, r=0. Obviously, in
- terms of survival, shooting at the ugly would be wasting a shot. Thus we have
- made a complex problem more simple but retaining the essence of the paradox:
-
- If there are two gunmen who shoot and think with perfect logic and are kept
- inside a room and are allowed to shoot at discrete time intervals without
- being able to "see" what your opponent will do, what will happen?
-
- Let's say that you are one of the gunmen (the Good). You reason "My probability
- to survive the next round is independent on whether or not I fire at him." So
- you say to yourself, "Fire at the opponent! I'll get to stop playing this
- blasted game." But then you realize that your opponent will also think the same
- way...so you might think that you might as well not shoot. But if your
- opponent thinks that way, then you know that: 1. You can survive the next
- round. 2. You can shoot him if you wish on this round (if you like). So you
- say to yourself, "Fire at the opponent!". But you know the opponent thinks the
- same way so... you're dead. But really, you say. Is there a way of "knowing"
- what the opponent thinks? Of course not. You reason that you can know your
- probability of shooting your opponent (either 1 or 0). You reason that your
- opponent has a variable probability of shooting you. Thus from your
- perspective, p=1 and r<1. We already discussed this case and said "Shoot!".
- But wait you cry! What if the opponent figures this out too: p<1, r=1? Sorry,
- you're both dead. 'nuff said! This applies to the p=r=q=1 case as well.
-
- > But all this is under the assumption that no shooter can tell what
- > the others are about to do until after all have shot.
-
- Ay, there's the rub!
-
- >This isn't entirely unreasonable--we can certainly set up a game that plays
- > this way--but suppose we assume instead:
- >
- > All three start out with guns initially holstered.
- > Each one is a blindingly fast shot: he can grab his holstered gun,
- > aim, and fire in 0.6 second.
- > A shooter can redirect his unholstered gun at a different target and
- > fire in just 0.4 second.
- > The reaction time of each shooter is just 0.2 second. That is, any
- > decision he makes to act can be based only on the actions of the
- > other two up to 0.2 second before he initiates his own action.
- > The bullets travel between shooters in less than 0.1 second and
- > stop any further action when they hit.
- >
- > Then I *think* the conclusion holds for p=q=r=1: The best strategy is
- > to wait for someone else to grab for their gun, then shoot that
- > person, therefore nobody will shoot at anyone. At least I haven't yet
- > thought of a case in which you improve your survival by shooting at
- > anyone. Of course this is only good if you don't mind waiting around
- > the circle forever.
-
- Hmmn...alternate ploy:
-
- 0.0 You begin to unholster your gun
- 0.2 Opponents begin unholstering guns. You aim into the ground for .2 sec.
- 0.4 Opponents are unholstered you are unholstered. They note you aren't
- aiming at them. They haven't aimed at anyone yet.
-
- What happens now? I'll have to think about it, but I haven't seen anything
- fundamentally different between this and the above case yet.
-
- More ideas to consider:
-
- You begin unholstering your gun but only for .1 sec (you place it by .2 )
- You begin unholstering your gun but only for .09 sec (you place it by .19)
-
- You start to aim for .1 sec and then stop aiming.
- You start to aim for .1 sec and then turn and aim at another.
- You start to aim for .09 sec and then stop aiming (or aim at another)
-
- -Greg
-
- Looking at the answer for decision/truel, I came across the following:
-
- >Each player can obtain a positive expected payoff by shooting at one of the
- >other players, and it is known that an infinite sequence of misses will
- >result in a zero payoff for all players. So it is known that some player's
- >strategy must involve shooting at another player rather than deliberately
- >missing.
-
- This may be true but it's not obvious to me. For example, suppose A, B,
- and C are passengers in a lifeboat in a storm. If they all stay aboard,
- the lifeboat is certain to sink eventually, taking all three to the
- bottom with it. If anyone jumps overboard, the two remaining in the
- boat are guaranteed to survive, while the person who jumped has a 1%
- chance of survival.
-
- It seems to me the lifeboat satisfies the quoted conditions, in the
- sense that if nobody jumps then the payoff for all is zero, and the
- payoff for jumping is 0.01 which is positive. But it is not clear to
- me that the three shouldn't just all sit still until someone goes nuts
- and jumps overboard despite everything, for this strategy gives a 67%
- chance of survival (assuming everyone is equally likely to "crack"
- first) vs. only 1% for jumping by choice. Even if there is a wave
- about to swamp the boat, I'd wonder if the situation wouldn't just
- reduce to a game of "chicken," with each person waiting until the last
- minute and jumping only if it seems the other two have decided to sink
- with the boat if you don't jump.
-
- On the other hand, this situation is set up so it is always worse to
- be the first person to jump. In the truel I don't think this is true,
- but only because of the asymmetry of the odds, and to determine
- whether *anyone* shoots, it is easiest to proceed directly to
- considering B's point of view.
-
- Whenever it is B's turn to shoot, B can divide the possible courses of
- action into four possibilities (actually there are seven, but three
- are ruled out a priori by obvious optimizations of each individual's
- strategy):
-
- Nobody ever shoots (expected value 0)
- A shoots first (at B, expected value <= .7)
- C shoots first (at B, expected value <= .5)
- B shoots first (at C, expected value .7)
-
- In fact the value of "A shoots first" is strictly less than .7 because
- in case A misses, the same four possibilities recur, and all have
- expected payoff < 1.
-
- So the value of "B shoots first" uniquely maximizes B's value function,
- ergo B will always shoot as soon as possible.
-
- The rest of the analysis then follows as in the archive.
-
- -- David Karr (karr@cs.cornell.edu)
-
- > Looking at the answer for decision/truel, I came across the following:
- >
- > >Each player can obtain a positive expected payoff by shooting at one of the
- > >other players, and it is known that an infinite sequence of misses will
- > >result in a zero payoff for all players. So it is known that some player's
- > >strategy must involve shooting at another player rather than deliberately
- > >missing.
- >
- > This may be true but it's not obvious to me. For example, suppose A, B,
- > and C are passengers in a lifeboat in a storm. If they all stay aboard,
- > the lifeboat is certain to sink eventually, taking all three to the
- > bottom with it. If anyone jumps overboard, the two remaining in the
- > boat are guaranteed to survive, while the person who jumped has a 1%
- > chance of survival.
- >
- > It seems to me the lifeboat satisfies the quoted conditions, in the
- > sense that if nobody jumps then the payoff for all is zero, and the
- > payoff for jumping is 0.01 which is positive. But it is not clear to
- > me that the three shouldn't just all sit still until someone goes nuts
- > and jumps overboard despite everything, for this strategy gives a 67%
- > chance of survival (assuming everyone is equally likely to "crack"
- > first) vs. only 1% for jumping by choice. ...
-
- Yes and no. Yes in the sense that if you treat the game as a psychological
- one, the best strategy is as you say. But treating it as a mathematical
- game, you've got to adhere to your strategy and you've got to assume that
- others will adhere to theirs.
-
- I.e. as a mathematical game, "Don't jump at all" and "Don't jump unless I
- crack" are different strategies, and the first one is often (not always)
- superior - e.g. if I take "Don't jump at all" and the others take "Don't
- jump unless I crack", I'm certain to survive and the others each have a
- 50.5% chance, which is better from my point of view than a 67% chance of
- survival for all of us. As a psychological game, some of the mathematical
- strategies may simply not be available - i.e. you cannot control what you
- will do if you crack, and so we commonly use "Don't jump" to mean "Don't
- jump unless I crack", since "Don't jump at all" is not an available strategy
- for most real humans. But for mathematical analysis, the problem has to tell
- you what strategies you are not allowed to take.
-
- What the argument above shows is that "Don't jump at all" is not a stable
- strategy, in the sense that if everyone takes it, it is in everyone's
- interest to change strategy. I.e. it shows that someone will jump
- eventually, even if it's only the result of someone actually having taken
- "Don't jump unless I crack".
-
- Applied to the truel, the argument above *does* show that someone's strategy
- will involve shooting at another player: the strategy "Don't shoot at all"
- is unstable in exactly the same way as "Don't jump at all" was. But I agree
- it allows for a lot of leeway about how and when the deadlock gets broken,
- and your argument showing that it is always in B's interest to shoot is more
- satisfactory.
-
- David Seal
-
-